Wikipedia:Village pump (technical)

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Bots editing Village Pump ArchivesEdit

I was trying to sort by last edit date and I came across this Multiple bots seem to be updating archives. Archives are supposed to stay unchanged etc, but I think based on the history, they seem to fix one issue and leave.

Also a lot of it seems to do sigs having font's and colours, maybe the archive bots could strip those?

Or much bigger idea have the colours and fonts as the page is displayed, from the current sig, like the strikethrough for blocked users? Wakelamp d[@[email protected]]b (talk) 12:00, 23 September 2022 (UTC)

@Wakelamp this is expected behavior. History stays the same forever, "archives" are just copy-paste to make it easy for readers to reference things - these updates are for the benefit of the readers. In many cases, they are restoring the content to look how it originally was intended - as the parser changed breaking certain old markups. — xaosflux Talk 12:39, 23 September 2022 (UTC)
I guess few users sort archives by last edit date so I wouldn't interfere with relevant bot edits to try to preserve an old date. You aren't supposed to make new posts to archives but fixing lint errors and formatting issues is perfectly fine whether bots or users do it. By the way, I have a script User:PrimeHunter/Search sort.js which can sort by all ten options at mw:Help:CirrusSearch#Explicit sort orders, not just the three at Special:Search. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:49, 23 September 2022 (UTC)
Thank-you all. The special search looks great. Two last questions
"they seem to fix one issue and leave." Why do bots do this?
and, is there a tool for extracting topic name links from. I am categorising connected proposals, and seeing which were successful. I am rubbish at creating them, and I think some proposals, that are not marked as perennial, may be worth doing, Wiktionary has a log i think that works that way, and also shows the number of editors involved. Wakelamp d[@[email protected]]b (talk) 06:19, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
@Wakelamp, Why do bots do this? This has been discussed a lot at WP:BOTN. You might want to try the archives there. — Qwerfjkltalk 19:40, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
It's better to sort by creation date instead. That way the recently created archives always show up towards the top. – SD0001 (talk) 05:58, 24 September 2022 (UTC)

Extracting WikiProjects on a talk page using template/moduleEdit

I was wondering if there is a way to extract out the names of the WikiProjects used on a given talk page, for example Talk: United States, such that when the particular template/module is used, it will create an array United States; Countries; North America; United States Government. It would be very helpful if there is a way to do just that. Thanks! CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {CX}) 22:17, 25 September 2022 (UTC)

Why? Izno (talk) 22:44, 25 September 2022 (UTC)
Given the huge backlog of COI edit requests, I figured out that topic-wise categorisation (inbuilt from {{edit request}}) might be more helpful than a list all category. It helps in finding the requests that you might be more interested in reviewing because you primarily work in that area, potentially reducing the backlog. If template/module cannot do it, alternatively, I may have to file a bot request. CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {CX}) 07:11, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
Would a PetScan to intersect Category:Wikipedia conflict of interest edit requests and Category:WikiProject United States articles work for your use case? —⁠andrybak (talk) 11:05, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
@Andrybak: Looks like it could work but I'm having troubles with it. Anything I search shows 0 results even though it should not. Maybe I'm putting in the wrong input. Can you please give an example input? Thanks! CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {CX}) 12:27, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
Here you go. Most likely you weren't setting the namespace in the Page Properties tab; by default, it'll only show pages in the main namespace, and you want Talk: instead for both of those categories. —Cryptic 13:10, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
Thank you very much. CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {CX}) 13:21, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
@Hellknowz, is this something you could add to Wikipedia:Article alerts? WhatamIdoing (talk) 17:02, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
@WhatamIdoing: In theory. The problem is that the bot can only do 1 workflow per page. The first page I clicked for an example had like 5 of them. I see many have multiple. The bot won't recognize that a page has 2+ different requests - it will list only one of them, pick one of the dates/authors and won't close or update it until all requests are done. Basically, as long as the page is in the COI request category. So it will basically show incorrect values for those cases (although it will still report them). There's no easy way for me to work around this (other than to hide the values, but then that will make the entries undated). Also, a bigger question is the scope of bot reports. Are COI requests more important than the thousands of regular ones? In theory, the bot can just have an edit request section for each project, including COI reports, which would be ideal. But that still leaves the problem of multiple requests. —  HELLKNOWZ  TALK 17:20, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
For myself, I'd rather see all the pages with an open edit request, not just the COI ones. One per page is probably enough, because (a) if you're on the page anyway, you can see what other requests are there and (b) even if you don't, if you close that one, then tomorrow the bot will presumably notice and report the next one on the page.
If it could be coded in five minutes or less, I'd also rather not see extremely recent edit requests (say, less than 12–24 hours old), because that would give the regular patrollers a chance to remove empty/accidental edit requests. This should improve the signal-to-noise ratio for Article Alerts. WhatamIdoing (talk) 00:39, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
"if you close that one, then tomorrow the bot will presumably notice and report the next one on the page." That's the problem - the bot won't notice that anything has changed because the page will still be in the same category. It will continue reporting the first request until every request is closed. It will continue reporting the date, the author and the section link of the old request. Even after all are closed, it will still only list the page as if it had one request during that time and was closed when the last request was closed. If a new request is added soon, the bot will think the old request was reopened.
"If it could be coded in five minutes or less, I'd also rather not see extremely recent edit requests" Unfortunately, this would take way longer to implement than that. Without going into technicals, everything assumes that "active means active" and I cannot filter entries like that without breaking things. And yeah, knowing how many empty and useless edit request I've seen that need no action expect be closed, I can see how early reports like this would be a problem. —  HELLKNOWZ  TALK 10:06, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
Avoiding the new ones has some obvious benefits to "me" (=whoever is reading the AAlerts page) and some not-so-obvious costs, like an inaccurate perception of reality. This is why I suggest that "my" convenience be factored in if the cost to you for doing so were very small.
As for the other problem, it sounds like it's a bug that can be addressed in documentation. Instead of "Edit requests", it should say "Edit requests – due to technical limitations, only one is shown per page. If the linked section is closed, check for other open requests on the page". You could alternatively address it by linking only to the whole page, with no section/date information. Then it would always be correct. WhatamIdoing (talk) 15:57, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

Multiple IPs for same user on same browser at same timeEdit

I tried to do some logged out testing, only to realize that I'm caught in the range block for Special:Contribs/2409:4061::/34. Same thing on test & test2 Wikipedia. So, I resorted to where my IP address is a completely different I'm using the same device, same browser. I tried moving around quite a bit and realized that on all Wikimedia wikis (Special:SiteMatrix), I have the 2409 IP. Whereas on all wmflabs wikis (SiteMatrix), I have the 47 IP. How can this be possible simultaneously? CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {CX}) 20:20, 26 September 2022 (UTC)

Perhaps that betalabs doesn't support IPV6, hard to tell from here since they don't normally allow anon edits. Many people ave both an IPv4 and IPv6 address, but if the remote end doesn't support IPv6 along the entire route, proxies may get invoked by your ISP as well. — xaosflux Talk 20:29, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
Indeed, Wikimedia Cloud Services (including Beta Cluster, Toolforge, etc.) doesn't support IPv6 yet, so users will be forced over to IPv4. Legoktm (talk) 05:17, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

Replag currently at 5 hours; reports may be delayed or appear to be out of dateEdit


Just an FYI that replication lag is currently at 5 hours. This sort of lag leads to database reports that do not run or that, when they update, contain information that is out of date. When the numbers in the linked page go back to zero, reports that are run afterwards should update correctly. – Jonesey95 (talk) 04:50, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

For the record this was marked as resolved at 14:30 (UTC) on the day this was posted. Graham87 03:49, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

Limitations (I'm being polite) of mobile Visual Editor?Edit

Gosh—has anyone else been using the mobile browser-based implementation of WP's Visual Editor? Compared to the desktop version, which is generally flawless, the mobile version is so full of bugs, I continually worry about seriously damaging articles due to errors it generates that I may overlook before saving them.
You may tap the screen, and the cursor appears on a different line entirely. You select a word and backspace to delete it, and a different word is deleted instead—or parts of two different words. Sometimes, when you resume editing an article and try to scroll down to the place where you left off, the editor keeps snapping back up to the top of the content, like you've let go of a roller shade too quickly. (At least it spares us the "flap flap" noise.)
I'm always entering source-code mode to repair VE-caused errors, going back and forth to be sure what I'm seeing in the VE reflects reality. Many times I've had to open an article's existing version in a new tab to copy and restore source code where the VE inexplicably deleted it.
Why not stick with the source editor, you may ask, or the desktop version of the VE? Despite my cavalier comments, I'm a busy guy, and my WP-editing opportunities are fleeting enough that I usually have time for them only on my close-at-hand phone (running Android 10 in Firefox—guess I should mention that). And while the ability to edit source code is undeniably valuable, I find it tremendously easier to focus on content without the ubiquitous, overwhelmingly competitive plethora o' extra-textual tags.
Anyway, sorry if I seem to be kvetching. I've actually coped with the mobile VE's quirkiness for years now without saying anything. (For one thing, I didn't know where to say it.)
And one more somewhat-related thing: Why does the mobile VE allow us only to post on Talk pages, not edit or preview them? As you can imagine, this can be a very frustrating one-two punch of embarrassing inaccuracy. Dunno about you—but when addressing my fellow WP obsessives editors, I feel compelled to be at my most anal vigilant, writing-wise.
(Ironically, I see that, unlike regular article pages, this meta-page does have a Preview button. 🤷‍♂️ )
Thanks—I'll hang up now and take my answer off the air. – AndyFielding (talk) 09:33, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

@AndyFielding It has limitations for sure. Some are imposed on us by the mobile environments (phone makers really want us to build apps that they have full control over rather than websites…), some are our own fault (I'm one of the developers).
Regarding the text input problems, may I hazard a guess that you're using the Gboard keyboard? There was a long-standing compatibility issue, where due to the way that the keyboard sends text, the editor would sometimes "lose track" of what is being typed, ultimately causing the text being shown on the screen to not match what the editor really contained. This can then lead to further issues like text being deleted (or typed) in the wrong place. Good news is that it seems we've finally fixed this (with a contribution from a developer at Fandom (Wikia)) – you can find the details at T312558, and test the new version now at There may be similar problems with other keyboards too, but this is a very popular one.
Regarding mobile talk pages, the interface there is unrelated to visual editor, only enabled on some pages (that's why you see a different behavior on this page than normal talk pages), and we're currently in the process of replacing it with a new one, based on the desktop reply tool. You can read the status updates on this work at mw:Talk pages project/Mobile. It will have a preview :)
I don't have an immediate response to the other issues, but if you can reproduce them consistently, it would be very helpful for debugging if you could record your screen while demonstrating the problem and shared the video somewhere. Matma Rex talk 21:48, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
MR: Thanks for your thoughtful and informative reply. Yes, I've been using Gboard, but have alternatives at my disposal. I'll try them, as well as your beta. (Hmm, no Preview button here again, I see… Maybe it's in effect only on certain days of the week. 😄) – AndyFielding (talk) 00:51, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

Re: Pushpin map of the world's FAs (discussion from March)Edit

Map of Featured Articles with locations

Hello, a little update to everyone involved in the discussion "Pushpin map of the world's FAs" from March, @Sdkb, Jéské Couriano, Pppery, The wub, Donald Albury, NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh, TheDJ, Agathoclea, Whatamidoing (WMF)):

As of yesterday, it is possible to use geopoints from Wikidata in Kartographer maps, via QID or SPARQL query. -- Best, Johanna Strodt (WMDE) (talk) 10:09, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

How cool, thanks very much Johanna! And please pass on my thanks to those who worked on this improvement, I'm sure it will be useful for a lot of other applications. Only just saw this as I didn't get a notification about your message for some reason. I had a go at making a map for the featured articles, pinging Sdkb as the person who originally requested it. the wub "?!" 23:25, 2 October 2022 (UTC)

Template substitution brings a visually different result from expectedEdit

I was creating Template:Undated/sandbox to do some experiments. I test them at User:CX Zoom/TestPage34. For all examples, the normal transclusion works fine just as anyone would expect it to. But for whatever reason, the substitution is unexpectedly different for example 2. Why did this happen? (I can think of a workaround using nested #if & #ifeq so that the template could work but maybe I hit a bug or something?) CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {CX}) 10:49, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

@CX Zoom: Some templates don't work with subst. {{str rightc}} tries to but fails. {{str rightc|abcdefg|5}} produces cdefg which currently says cdefg as it should. {{subst:str rightc|abcdefg|5}} currently produces blank so it matches the blank switch case | = | in Template:Undated/sandbox. PrimeHunter (talk) 03:47, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
I added a safesubst to {{str rightc}} [1] and everything appears to work now. PrimeHunter (talk) 03:56, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
Thank you very much. Your edit fixed the issue. CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {CX}) 05:45, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

Dumber search?Edit

When I search for the word "alarmism" [2], I get hits for "alarm", which is not what I want. I know what I want and I try to tell the search algorithm what I want, but it thinks it is smarter than me and knows better. If I try to exclude "alarm", I get no hits, probably because that also excludes "alarmism".

Is there a way to stop the search algorithm from dunning-krugering like that? --Hob Gadling (talk) 15:57, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

You can try something like Special:Search/Alarmism insource:/alarmism/. Add i to the end if you also want to include Alarmism, etc. Certes (talk) 16:08, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
@Hob Gadling: It's better to use quotation marks like you did in the post but not the search. insource:/.../ is called a regex search. It's expensive and may not have time to search all pages. It helps if you combine it with a normal search like alarmism insource:/alarmism/ but for this purpose, you can just use "alarmism". See more at Help:Searching. PrimeHunter (talk) 16:12, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
Ah! Thank you both! I did not think of Help:Searching or of quotation marks. --Hob Gadling (talk) 16:22, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
This may be a goofy question, but: Why does WP return results that don't include the searched-for term (especially if the term is in quotes—which, on most search engines, indicates it's mandatory)? If that happened to me, I'd assume no pages existed with the searched-for term, but the search feature was trying to be helpful. – AndyFielding (talk) 01:03, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
@AndyFielding: Help:Searching#Stem matching says: "Search results will include the roots of words included in the search string, and their various tenses (plural, past-tense, etc.). If stem matching is not wanted, use double quotes around the word or phrase you want to match verbatim." Do you have an example where a search term in quotes returns results without the term? PrimeHunter (talk) 01:15, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

It's interesting to me that insource has been shown in examples, but what it does has not actually been mentioned, and it's pretty critical to know whether or not it's appropriate. IMO, the first thing you should consider is whether you want to search the page source or the rendered text. The default is the rendered text. Use insource: only if you want to search the page source. Also, it seems that Wikipedia search treats the content as a series of words, and delimiters (the characters that separate words) are not considered, e.g. unless you're using a regex search, search terms "foo/bar" and "foo+bar" will return identical results. Keep in mind also that Wikipedia search isn't google search, it's not going to guess at what you might really have wanted. Fabrickator (talk) 01:50, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

AndyFieldingCertes only suggested alarmism insource:/alarmism/ as a way to get an exact match (quotes is a better way here). A regex search insource:/.../ cannot be used on the rendered result. By the way, insource:/alarmism/ doesn't find Alarmism while "alarmism" does find it. Add i like insource:/alarmism/i for a case insensitive regex search. It goes from 97 to 134 results. "alarmism" gives 129 results. The five "missing" pages can be seen with alarmism insource:/alarmism/i -"alarmism". Three only has "alarmism" in the source and two say "Alarmism's" which is treated as one word and not found by "alarmism". PrimeHunter (talk) 02:25, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
Quoted text probably gives what you need here and is much more efficient than my original suggestion of insource:. There is more help at mw:Help:CirrusSearch, and an explanation of the very limited and non-standard regular expression syntax here. Certes (talk) 08:36, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for your thoughtful explanations. I may have misinterpreted the OP's post, thinking his quotation marks were literal. (Discussing search strings, perhaps italics would've been a better idea—or putting the search terms on their own indented lines?) – AndyFielding (talk) 12:35, 2 October 2022 (UTC)


How to use "reason 2"? Eurohunter (talk) 18:36, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

@Eurohunter There is no "reason 2", the 2nd unnamed parameter will be interpreted as "reason", or you can explicitly use the "reason" named parameter. — xaosflux Talk 18:44, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
@Xaosflux: Second unnamed parameter doesn't works in this way (no effect). Eurohunter (talk) 18:46, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
Hmm ok maybe not, looks like maybe that used to work but doesn't now - perhaps should be removed from the doc. — xaosflux Talk 18:55, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
There is no mention of |2= in the template's documentation. I have removed all references to parameter |2= from the template's code, since it apparently has not worked for many years and is not present in any transclusions, as far as I can tell. I do not edit the Visual Editor's Template Data code, which is stored on the documentation page; someone else is welcome to remove references to |2= from that unprotected code. – Jonesey95 (talk) 20:16, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
2 (second unnamed parameter) has been disallowed as alternative to reason, maybe unintentionally, since [3] by MSGJ in 2012. I guess any old uses of 2 were replaced years ago because it didn't work. There is no need to make it work now. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:37, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
@Jonesey95 there was in Special:Diff/1112735638 (it's gone now). — xaosflux Talk 20:39, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for that cleanup. FWIW, I stand by what I wrote above. Mixing programming code and actual template documentation has always been a bad idea. I don't know why it has taken 10+ years to separate them properly. (*gets down from high horse, which shows few signs of life*)Jonesey95 (talk) 21:13, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

Strange transclusionsEdit

Hello! So on the article List of The Simpsons episodes (season 21–present) all other seasons have the pages transcluded and it only shows the table. However strangely seasons 33 and 34 (which i've commented out for now while I try and figure this out) show the entire article and not just the table, despite the formatting of the transclusion link being the exact same as the previous seasons. Anyone know why this is happening? ― Blaze WolfTalkBlaze Wolf#6545 19:22, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

@Blaze Wolf series 33 is lacking some <onlyinclude> tags to delineate the parts that get transcluded. Have a look at the series 32 article to see where they should go. Nthep (talk) 19:30, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
Ah that would explain it. I was rather confused since I Didn't actually know how it worked. Thanks! ― Blaze WolfTalkBlaze Wolf#6545 19:32, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
They took me years to get my head round and I still have to think hard about them now. Nthep (talk) 19:34, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
Looks like it was just some vandalism that removed them and ended up breaking it. ― Blaze WolfTalkBlaze Wolf#6545 19:35, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
The IP made much more of a mess on 33 than on 34. THey've been given a final warning for it (the edit history on 33 is a little messy since i accidentally restored the wrong version when fixing it) ― Blaze WolfTalkBlaze Wolf#6545 19:50, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
Re: the last bit, you need {{User screw}} on your user page. :-) Nthep (talk) 20:02, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
I have fixed countless such removals of <onlyinclude>...</onlyinclude>. An episode list often adds a DISPLAYTITLE with italics for the title of the show. Part of the episode list is often transcluded in another article about the show. Without onlyinclude the whole page including DISPLAYTITLE is transcluded. This adds the page to Category:Pages with disallowed DISPLAYTITLE modifications which I monitor for articles. I sometimes add a source comment like [4] to explain that onlyinclude is needed. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:58, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

Template:Television network original programming category puts cats inside themselvesEdit

Gonnym (talk · contribs) isn't around much these days, so I'm asking here. Under certain circumstances, {{Television network original programming category}} puts categories inside themselves unless it's configured properly; twice in the past Gonnym has fixed up such problems as requested at User talk:Gonnym/Archive 3#Template:Television network original programming category, User talk:Gonnym/Archive 4#Television network original programming category and User talk:Gonnym/Archive 4#Zee Marathi Original Programming, but didn't explain what actualy needed doing (there is an expln of sorts on the last one, but it's not at all clear). Now Category:Fox Kids is suffering the same problem: it's inside itself (reported at Wikipedia:Database reports/Self-categorized categories). Does anybody know what needs doing to the template in order fix the cat? --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 20:34, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

I have added |no_cat=1.[5] PrimeHunter (talk) 20:45, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
I have also made a more general solution which automatically omits adding a category to itself.[6] PrimeHunter (talk) 21:05, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
In general, if you want to prevent a template from categorizing pages, try |no_cat=1 before asking for help. This frequently will solve the problem. Animal lover |666| 08:04, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
The param is mentioned in the templatedata, but is otherwise undocumented. The impression that I got was that it concerned parent cats, which I wanted left alone. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 08:29, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
It does concern a parent cat. Adding the cat itself (usually unintentionally) is a special case of a parent cat. no_cat is a non-standard parameter name only used in this template. nocat is the common name recommended at Wikipedia:Category suppression. Category suppression usually suppresses all parent categories but in {{Television network original programming category}} it only suppresses one of two. That is confusing when it's undocumented. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:14, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
I have changed the non-standard no_cat to nocat in the template [7] and the six calls which used it. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:26, 30 September 2022 (UTC)

Global userpages not showing up in autocomplete search results?Edit

Has anyone else noticed this? I'm not sure if this is a new bug or if I just haven't spotted it in the past. If an editor has a global user page it doesn't appear in the autocomplete results drop down - their subpages appear fine, but not the main userpage. (talk) 21:03, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

Please always post an example. A global user page is only visible if the user has a local account but no local user page. I gave up finding an example. Assuming you are right, I don't think it's a bug. A global userpage may be in another language, especially at non-English wikis, and the user may have no local edits. If they create a local user page then it shows up. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:24, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
@PrimeHunter Try searching for "User:Mike Peel". All his user space subpages show up in the autocomplete drop down menu, but not his main userpage, because it's global. (talk) 21:31, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
Thanks. It may look missing here when he has many subpages and 74,000 edits but imagine you are at mzn:, a small wiki with few active users and another script. Type User:Mike in the search box and there are two users. Do they want autocompletion to be "polluted" with numerous global user pages in a foreign script for users who have no local edits and probably don't know the language? PrimeHunter (talk) 21:47, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
Based on blue links at mzn:Special:ListUsers/Mike the "pollution" in this case would only be four global user pages but none of them have local edits. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:51, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
The behaviour here seems to be inconsistent. The user page doesn't appear in the drop down autocomplete results, but if you actually do the search for "User:Mike Peel" the first thing it gives you is an autocomplete like notice that this page exists on wikipedia. When you actually look at the list of search results though the page doesn't appear again.
If you're asking for my opinion, I do think that it would be better for global user pages to appear in autocomplete and search results - it just seems weird and unhelpful to have user pages that are intentionally difficult to access, and it can make searching for people a pain. As long as usual search result ranking is applied (i.e. pages with few incoming links appear at the bottom) the addition of global users shouldn't be too disruptive, accounts that don't edit on a certain project will be at the bottom of the results. (talk) 22:17, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
Global user pages have never appeared in local search results nor autocomplete. T108534 tracks this. Legoktm (talk) 00:38, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

Check if all transclusions of a specific template are done via an other specific templateEdit

I would like to check if all transclusions of several templates (such as Template:Ethnologue25) are done via Template:Infobox language/ref, and if this template (except on the template's own documentation) is only called via Template:Infobox language. Note that I'm talking about the actual specific transclusions, not just appearance on the same page. Is there any way to do this? Animal lover |666| 07:59, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

@Animal lover 666: hastemplate:"Ethnologue25" -hastemplate:"Infobox language/ref" finds four articles which transclude {{Ethnologue25}} without transcluding {{Infobox language/ref}}. The search is based on the whole page so there may be other pages which transclude both in different places without one of them calling the other. I don't think there is a general way to search for that. For specific cases there may be ways by searching the source for how the templates are used. For example, hastemplate:"Ethnologue25" insource:Ethnologue25 finds three articles which call {{Ethnologue25}} in their own source. There could be other cases where {{Ethnologue25}} is called via a template but not via {{Infobox language/ref}}. But insource:Ethnologue25 in template space only finds {{Infobox language/ref}} and a non-transclusion link in {{Ethnolink/doc}}. hastemplate:"Ethnologue25" only finds 23 articles in total so they could also be examined manually with some work. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:29, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

Preference "Expand watchlist to show all changes, not just the most recent" doesn't seem to workEdit

I've always had "Expand watchlist to show all changes, not just the most recent" enabled, but suddenly (probably because it's WP:THURSDAY?), changes are grouped anyway. I've tried disabling and re-enabling the preference, but I see no difference in my watchlist one way or the other. I'm using Chrome 105.0.5195.127 on Windows 10. --rchard2scout (talk) 13:22, 29 September 2022 (UTC)


For the last two-three days, I have been blocked and then unblocked. I have done nothing wrong. Any help and suggestions would be appreciated. This has happen several times in the past. Thank You-RFD (talk) 20:59, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

What is the message that appears when this happens?(you may leave off any IP that appears) It's not your account(which has never been blocked). 331dot (talk) 21:11, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
There's actually no need to answer that. RFD: I'm going to grant you block exemption, as I did before, which should allow you to edit whenever. This time it'll be good for the next two years. -- zzuuzz (talk) 21:26, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
Thank You-RFD (talk) 21:27, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

Chinese WikipediaEdit

I cannot log on to Chinese Wikipedia, help please? Taiwanrailtransportfan (talk) 23:50, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

What goes wrong? Can you view pages at zh:? PrimeHunter (talk) 00:04, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
Yes, but not logged in. The problem is if I want to edit with my account there - it's not possible now, since I can't log in. Taiwanrailtransportfan (talk) 00:06, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
But what happens when you try to log in? "I cannot" and "it's not possible" are very vague. PrimeHunter (talk) 00:15, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
The action gets cancelled, according to Chinese Wikipedia, as a "precaution against session hijacking." Taiwanrailtransportfan (talk) 00:20, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
Try reloading a zh: page with Ctrl+F5. Try logging out here first. If it doesn't work, try another browser or device if possible. If that works but you want to use your current device and browser, try deleting cookies for and PrimeHunter (talk) 00:37, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
I'm browsing in guest mode, so I don't think I have cookies in the first place. Is there a possible way to log in? Is my username an issue? Taiwanrailtransportfan (talk) 22:15, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
@Taiwanrailtransportfan you are not able to create an account at zhwiki because of your username. I can't give you any more details then that. Perhaps there is a part of your username that may be problematic on zhwiki. You can request a username change at Special:GlobalRenameRequest. I don't know of ways for you to contact the zhwiki admins by email, but that could also be an option. — xaosflux Talk 22:23, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
@Xaosflux: Are you sure of that? It would be an odd error message for that. I can create (didn't save it) the user page zh:User:Taiwanrailtransportfan but not the article zh:Taiwanrailtransportfan. zh:MediaWiki:Titleblacklist says (?!User:|User talk:).*(Taiwan).* <autoconfirmed> This disallows the page name Taiwanrailtransportfan but only outside userspace. zh:Special:Listusers/Taiwan shows many usernames with "Taiwan", also from 2022. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:22, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
@PrimeHunter yes I am, the condition that would have precluded this has been around for about 5 months. — xaosflux Talk 23:32, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
As far as the error message goes, perhaps there is some translation messed up somewhere, it appears that it should have a fairly generic denial message. — xaosflux Talk 23:36, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
@Xaosflux: Thanks for the explanation. The 2022 usernames are from January to April. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:39, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
  • You may be able to get help from an admin on zhwiki by emailing them at: — xaosflux Talk 23:41, 30 September 2022 (UTC)

Template:Code and Too many expensive function callsEdit

Comparison of programming languages (basic instructions) is in Category:Pages with script errors. Searching the article shows that "Lua error: too many expensive function calls" occurs twice. However, that is misleading because preview reports "Expensive parser function count 683/500" so there is a big problem. It turns out that {{code}} is used 671 times and each call uses one expensive function due to use of syntaxhighlight (and there are 8 direct calls to syntaxhighlight). Assuming that the article is kept at its current size, are there any suggestions for a simple replacement for {{code}}? An example with a simple argument is:

  • {{code|long int}}long int

That could be replaced with

  • <code><nowiki>long int</nowiki></code>long int

The nowiki is not needed in this case but my guess is that lots of the more complex examples would need it and making a manual choice 671 times would not be desirable. Is there anything better? Johnuniq (talk) 04:54, 30 September 2022 (UTC)

Can we teach {{code}} to not invoke <syntaxhighlight> if lang=text (probably this should be done on the MediaWiki side too)? Also the last few comments on T316858 are relevant here. Legoktm (talk) 05:12, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
@Legoktm, I've hastily done this with {{Code/sandbox}}— Qwerfjkltalk 10:16, 30 September 2022 (UTC)

Expensive parser functionsEdit

C Sharp syntax has had this problem since yesterday. It has not been edited in months so something else must have changed. It uses {{C sharp}} a lot, but that hasn't changed either. MB 16:30, 2 October 2022 (UTC)

This is phab:T316858/#Template:Code and Too many expensive function calls; <syntaxhighlight>...</syntaxhighlight> is now expensive. * Pppery * it has begun... 16:33, 2 October 2022 (UTC)

Page moves without moving archivesEdit

In the past 3-4 months, I encountered 2 instances of page moves without moving talk page archives. And had to do that myself. In the older case, it took less than a day to find it out, in the latter case, it took over a month, and lowercase sigmabot had already created brand new archives at new title. I wonder how prevalent it is and what can be done to prevent it. Note that move subpages option is available only to page movers and administrators because of its disruption potential. CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {CX}) 14:18, 30 September 2022 (UTC)

Previously the archiving would have stopped after the move because the archive parameter no longer pointed to a subpage per User:MiszaBot/config#Parameters explained. If movers forget to move old archives then they usually also forget to update archive. Since July Aidan9382-Bot by Aidan9382 has automatically updated the parameter [8] without checking for old archives. The archive issue is mentioned in Category:Pages where archive parameter is not a subpage where the bot finds the pages but it wasn't brought up in Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval/Aidan9382-Bot 2. Maybe the bot should check for archives under the old archive value and do something else like flag it for editor attention. It probably shouldn't move archives automatically. A counter (the current archive number) above 1 is also a strong hint that there may be archives somewhere. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:38, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
@PrimeHunter: Thanks for the notice, I'd be glad to make this a feature of the bot. Question is, how do you suggest implementing this? Currently, my bot has a safety feature where if it 1) Can't find existing archives (Specifically archives 1 and archives counter) and 2) Notices the page already has some other subpage, it'll refuse to fix it and leaves a notice for another person (usually me) to clear it up manually. This was so it would never try to do anything as wild as this spectacular fail. Perhaps removing the second check and just having the first one would create a check like you suggested. Would that work for you? Aidan9382 (talk) 04:46, 1 October 2022 (UTC)
@PrimeHunter: Thanks. I was wondering if it would help if a bot could compile a list of talk page subpages whose parent page is a redirect. But that has it's own limitations, it would leave out pages like this one (3rd example) which was a wrongly created talk page because one of the mover moved the article without talk page, and thus the actual talk page became orphaned. CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {CX}) 08:15, 1 October 2022 (UTC)
@Aidan9382: It sounds like you check more than I thought. Does "Can't find existing archives" and "page already has some other subpage" refer to the wrong archive value or the current page name? Why did the bot make the edit I linked [9] when there was an archive at Talk:List of rivers by length/Archive 1? CX Zoom moved the archive later and posted here. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:41, 1 October 2022 (UTC)
@PrimeHunter: Let me elaborate - the bot checks the current location of the page for any existing archive subpage, not any previous name of the page due to reasons. My proposed idea is that I could have it so the bot wouldn't fix an archive if it found no existing subpages, which would imply they either havent moved over yet or dont exist, which would fix your issue here and allow a human to check it instead. Sorry if my explenation was a little poor. Aidan9382 (talk) 14:12, 1 October 2022 (UTC)
@Aidan9382: If you don't want to check for archives at the wrong archive and are willing to examine the extra cases manually then that sounds OK. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:28, 1 October 2022 (UTC)
@PrimeHunter: Dont worry, I used to do it manually before hand - its the whole reason I made the bot after a while. Anyways, the change is now   Done, so I'll see how this goes over the next few days. Thanks for bringing this to my attention. Aidan9382 (talk) 14:34, 1 October 2022 (UTC)
@Aidan9382: Thanks. And thanks for working on Category:Pages where archive parameter is not a subpage. I made the category and automatic population [10] but only fixed a few pages. There were originally more than 2700. PrimeHunter (talk) 15:15, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

editing glitch which moves cursor, disallows my use of capital lettersEdit

"II())NWhen I am editing in Wikipedia sometimes, nowadays, it seems I am allowed to use capital letters some of the time, as here where I have used "When" and "I". But some of the time, even within the same edit where I have successfully used some capital letters, I am disallowed: when I type a capital letter the cursor is moved to the beginning of the of the posting. I think this may occur only when I open a new discussion section on a Talk page, as here, by selecting the "+" option, which brings me into some kind of source mode with "Source" highlighted (rather than showing "Visual" highlighted). But it is different than regular source mode in that a--my posting will end by selecting "Add topic" and b--a continuously updated preview shows below. As opposed to if I am adding (in source mode) to an already-started discussion, where I can see a preview only by requesting it, and my posting will end by selecting "Publish changes". Sometimes the only way I can proceed is to use lower-case letters only. so i would be coming across more informally than i intend. I'm not sure, but the glitch may kick off only when I go back within the text I have already written, say I went back to change "nowadays" to "Nowadays". Then the cursor would move to the beginning and put "N" there, so this section would start "NWhen", while the word would have been changed to "owadays". Apparently also typing a parenthesis will do the same, because in this edit i tried that. the gibberish word which now starts this discussion is the result of cursor moving there. in this edit it has become impossible to type a capital letter or a quote mark or a parenthesis.

What gives? Is there something in my account which needs to be changed? --Doncram (talk) 18:27, 30 September 2022 (UTC)

@Doncram: Are you using a mobile device? CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {CX}) 20:12, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
CX Zoom, I am not on a mobile phone. I'm on an Acer "Spin 3" laptop, apparently running Windows 11 ("Windows Update" says that Windows 11, Version 22H2 is coming soon). --Doncram (talk) 20:51, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
@Doncram, you're using the New Topic tool in mw:Help:DiscussionTools. I think you're the second or third person to report this problem this year.
The first question is whether you have the GoogleTrans gadget enabled. If so, disabling that should solve the problem.[11]
If not, the second question is whether any part of this description sounds familiar. If so, I'm not sure how to fix it, but I have experienced it myself (usually in Firefox/Mac). Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 00:32, 1 October 2022 (UTC)
Yes there have been some mildly irritating mini-popups opening up, which I suppose were Google translation gadget offers to translate a given word like "owadays" (after the "n" was deleted by me from "nowadays", then I hit shift-n to try to enter "N") to some other language... I think it was sometimes offering to translate to Vietnamese!!! I simply did not understood what that was, and the mini-popups might have closed on their own and gone away. I suppose I did not describe them above because I didn't have the vocabulary to do so. I see now at my User preferences that indeed my user preferences show the feature is turned on ( "GoogleTrans: open a translation popup for the selected text or the word under the cursor when pushing the shift button". ) I did not knowingly turn that on. The mini-popup seems like a weird little thing, which would just translate a single word, from English to some other language? Yes, I was pushing the shift button to try to type (N) or quote mark (") or parenthesis "(" or ")".
Recently, however, I was interested to try to translate some full articles from Norwegian and French wikipedias, and I think i looked up Wikipedia:Translation first and then followed link to Wikipedia:Content translation tool, where per instructions I clicked the "blue button" labelled "Go to Special:ContentTranslation" and selected "Try it now!". I did succeed in translating and "publishing" one or two articles. I suppose that the blue button thing changed my User preference on that GoogleTrans gadget? At user preferences, I have just now turned it off, and I assume that will fix my problem raised here.
I am actually confused now about how I did successfully launch and use a big translation tool which set up side-by-side blocks of text from the source article, for me to translate from Norwegian or French into English ... maybe I was able to start up an article's translation when I was at the article in the Norwegian or French language Wikipedia? But anyhow I did not understand I was also enabling this small one-word-at-a-time thing. And now it is turned off and I dunno if i can find my way back to the one or two article translations I had left in progress. Maybe I will have to change the user preference back, in order to see/find my translations in progress? But that is a different problem than I posed here. Thanks, Whatamidoing (WMF) and all others here. --Doncram (talk) 02:40, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

HotDefaultSort settingEdit

I've noticed that User:BrandonXLF/HotDefaultSort sets {{DEFAULTSORT}} in a manner that omits the word "list" when this may be desirable in some categories. E.g. at List of existing technologies predicted in science fiction the defaultsort is set at "Existing technologies predicted in science fiction", even though sorting as "list" is desirable in non-list categories to show that a given page is a list rather than article. Because of that I personally favor manual setting of sortkeys depending on category. Should HotDefaultSort be amended in that regard? Brandmeistertalk 16:05, 2 October 2022 (UTC)

@Brandmeister, you should discuss this with @BrandonXLF at User talk:BrandonXLF. There is no technical problem here, so this isn't the right place. — Qwerfjkltalk 17:14, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
Actually, this was done manually, nothing to do with HotDefaultSort. You can instead discuss this with the editor that added the DEFAULTSORT. (Sorry for the ping, BrandonXLF.) — Qwerfjkltalk 17:22, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
Yep, that was me. I was sorting through stub articles and probably made some edits that don't coordinate with the organization of some categories. Please do re-edit to reflect that organization; my only request is that the lists don't get tagged as stubs. Also, thanks for the idea that lists are not articles, which hadn't occurred to me. Her Pegship (?) 18:34, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
Technically, lists are articles. All pages in mainspace are articles apart from dabs, redirects, the Main Page and any other exceptions I forgot. Certes (talk) 18:38, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
Ok, I've adjusted sortkeys. The edit summary said "using Hot Default Sort", so I thought it was done automatically and was agreed before. Brandmeistertalk 19:29, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
@Brandmeister, typically, fully automatic editing is done by bots. HotDefaultSort is a semi-automatic tool for modifying DEFAULTSORTs. — Qwerfjkltalk 19:53, 2 October 2022 (UTC)

Amazon Kindle CompatibilityEdit

Amazon Kindle: a good device for reading. The Wkipedia: a lot of articles.

I know the browser is experimental, but I think Wikipedia should become more bare bones, so the kindle could run it better.

Best Regards Anon — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 18:59, 2 October 2022 (UTC)

Well, ok, I guess. (talk) 19:32, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
Which Kindle model are you referring too? Kindle Fire models have the Silk Browser, and my Kindle Fire has the Wikipedia App installed. Both work well for reading Wikipedia. I agree that the browser on the original Kindle was very clunky. Wikipedia currently supports both desktop and mobile versions. - Donald Albury 21:44, 2 October 2022 (UTC)

Watchlist glitchEdit

The page Patty Loveless is on my watchlist. But for some reason, the watchlist is only showing edits made by me and not by others (for instance, it's not showing the edit by GünniX on October 1). Anyone know what's going on? Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 01:04, 3 October 2022 (UTC)